Father and son team banned from tournament

[fishon1219]

www.signonsandiego.com/sports/outdoors/20051220-9999-2s20outdoors.html

Just read this story, i wonder how much of this happens in team tournaments all over the country and people get away with it. I personaly couldnt live with myself knowing I violated the rules to win.

[Skulley]

Imagine what kind of example this sets for his son.  I fish with my daughter in the NBAA Weeknight tournaments and this is not the kind of example I would set for my kid.  The article didn't say how old the boy was.  I want to win because I caught fish not by doing what ever he and his son were doing.  Not the kind of example you would want to set for your kids.

BD

[Cheetam]

It's interesting to read that two other organizations are considering banning them for life...

[djkimmel]

I went through a somewhat similar episode in the federation while on the board with a couple members. Very bad for everyone involved.

Don't know why Kiegel refused a polygraph in this case. He may have been dq'd, but able to fish again (albeit with a tarnished reputation). You really have to be shiny spotless in tournaments and team tournaments are always risky, especially when fishing multiple circuits that may or may not have real clear rules. Especially nerve-racking if fishing an open with no written rules.

I keep reminding myself to read the rules right before the event so I hope to avoid a stupid mistake that could end up worse.

I have always preferred draw tournaments because of all the incidents in team tournaments over the year (probably just the tip of the real story if you look at people who 'bend' the rules - blowing no-wakes and other rule violations like that). I have found cages twice on Lake St. Clair - been a long time since the last time. I had an angler report to me that he caught several bass on fishing lines in the Grand here in Lansing that he cut lose, etc.

Draw tournaments aren't a guarantee as we've seen, but hopefully better. I have long thought any known and solid circuit with written rules should be able to report definite incidences of cheating to other similar circuits to certain anglers could be banned across the board to protect the rest of us a little.

I'm sure lawyers would end up involved and there will always be gray areas so it may never happen across the board, say on some kind of exclusion list kept by a group. The PAA could be the kind of group that could perform such a task. Regardless the controlling group would also have to be above reproach probably and acceptable universally to all anglers and circuits before it could work.

[blakstr1]

We had a situation 4 years ago at our Team BASS Charity Open on Sanford Lake.  A certain team of guys fishing from a walleye boat had been expected of foul play as they had been winning tournament after tournament in the area, (Kevin Vida helped us out with a good tip)  anyway our club president decided not to fish the tournament to concentrate on keeping everything fair with the contestants, he followed the walleye boat around with a video camera mounted to his boat.  In the first 2 hours the team landed 1 fish, then for an elapsed time of 8 minutes he lost sight of them as they slipped down a little cut and came back out, he then motored up to the walleye boat and said "Team Bass official just doing random livewell checks" (this is something that is in our tournament by laws which by entering everyone agrees too), the fellows in the walleye boat opened the livewell and had the one fish, then our president said, "now lets check the back livewell"..their jaws dropped, they got pretty defensive and almost hostle but proceeded to open it and had 6 beauties in there, all about 5lbs +!!  we immediately escorted them back to the ramp, gave them their entry fee back and had the park rangers show them off the property.  we could've pressed charges but didn't, they are now banned from any of our tournaments of course, but we notified every club in the area so nobody is letting them in.  Turns out, from what we gathered, is they had caught pond bass, kept them alive in a tank and had a friend bring them out onto a lake in a small fishing boat waiting for them to get there.  We have problems with their friends every year at our open, guys trying to mess our fishing up...its amazing to me people act like this, but as we see it happens all across the country.  Everytime someone associated with these guys wins a tournament we expect foul play, whether they are chaeting or not, they are blackballed for life.

[djkimmel]

Team events are always risky. I wish people would use honor and integrity in all their actions - treat others as they want to be treated. Fair and square.

A few people just can't seem to do that. They sure make it harder on the rest of us. Life is too short for this nonsense.

[MBell]

Too bad this happens.  If this happens in tournaments just document it the best you can and let the local authorities know.   If they cheat and take a check it's fraud which I believe can get them in some serious trouble if enough money is involved. 
-Matt 

[Skulley]

I believe that people like this should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.  If they get caught cheating, then they should pay the consequences no matter what the price.  Their friends should be banned and also prosecuted for assault for interfering where there should not be interference.  This is a case where a few bad apples spoil it for the ones who do have honor and integrity.  Some people just don't value honor and integrity.  Shame on them.  Eventually their judgement day will be upon them and then they will have to be accountable for all their actions for all of their lives.  Too bad for these people.  All we can do is pray for them.   

[djkimmel]

I agree

[dartag]

  can't you see it,  him sitting there with muggers, robbers, drug dealers.. one asks...  " so buddy what's ya in for? "  answer  " cheatin in a bass tournement "   

my mom always said  " cheaters never prosper "  and she is right.

[MBell]

There is an update to the story on bassfan.  Sounds like they were snagging fish intentionally,  there are a lot of quotes in the article and not one person denies it happened. 
-Matt

[djkimmel]

I wonder why someone would have been secretly filiming them? Or at least that area, that day??

Sounds fishier and fishier...

[MBell]

I bet they were suspected of cheating and this was what they were told to do in order to press some sort of charges.  In all of the cheating incidents I am aware of that resulted in someone being charged, suspected cheaters were allowed to cheat again in order to gain some video/witness evidence.  Almost the exact same thing happened a few years a go in indiana, It involved cages though and only a few hudered dollars. 
-Matt

[dhuff]

In anything you do and I don't care what it is bass tournament or a charity pot at church there is always cheating or stealing going on and if there isn't just wait because someone is thinking of it.  Sucks.  But I am not going to quit fishing tournaments because of a few.  Just do the best we can to catch those cheating and prosecute the the fullest to get the message across to others.  The guys in the secord tournament should of been prosecuted in order to get the message out to other potential cheaters.

[ronhuntfish]

The guys in the secord tournament should of been prosecuted in order to get the message out to other potential cheaters

What happened on Secord?

[djkimmel]

What happened on Secord?

I think we mean Sanford Lake - as in blakstr1's post above regarding an incident in one of their events.

[ronhuntfish]

The problem with the Sanford incident, was that they were not caught 'red handed'.  They were given their entry money and told not to come back.  Although they were not caught, to many things did not add up.  There is also a list of his fishing buddies that better watch what they do.

[djkimmel]

It is pretty tough if you don't have clear witnesses or evidence, but some guys do refuse the lie detector too and people have to follow all the rules, not just the ones they want to follow...