Livewell/Bilge Pump Question

[32eml24]

I have 2 questions.  Got my first boat of my own last year and didn't do any tournament fishing so I was never really concerned with the livewell, and I never ran into a situation where I thought I needed to use the bilge pump.  Now that it's winter and I'm sitting here watching FLW wishing I was out on the water, I have a few questions that I need to figure out before Spring rolls around.  My first question is with the livewell.  My boat is a 94 skeeter ss90, so it might be an older style livewell.  Whenever I go fishing, the livewells fill up.  Not all the way, maybe a little less than half.  The plugs are in the bottom of both sides.  It seemed to me that it was just filling up to wherever the water level was outside of the  boat.  Is this normal or something to be concerned about?  Also, I know it does fill up but I have never filled it the whole way because I don't see where the water would go if it was overfilled.  My dads boat always just circulated the extra out the side of the boat and it kept fresh water flowing through.  If I fill it all the way up is it going to flood out the top?  If it doesn't circulate, how do I keep some moving water in there in case I do want to fish a tournament and I need to keep my fish alive?  My second question is with the bilge pump.  When I flip the switch on my dash, the light comes on and I can hear the bilge pump turn on as well, but no water comes out the side.  I have had times where I know for a fact there was water in the boat after a rain and hit the bilge and nothing came out.  Pulled the boat out of the water the next day and when I pulled the drain plug had a lot of water coming out.  To me that seems like the pump isn't working.  I thought I could pull it out and set it in a bucket of water and see if it works, but I looked and found the hose running to the outlet on the side of the boat but couldn't follow it to any visible bilge pump.  Any idea where it would be located and is that a logical way to test it?  Thanks for any advice and pardon the lengthy explanation, just trying to give every little detail.  Think Spring!
Ethan

[bigjc]

Livewell: there could be litter (plastic bag, piece of plastic or card board, cigarette butts, etc.)  clogging the inlet at the bottom of the pump/pumps. 

1) locate the pump; 2) check to see if it is clogged; 3) w/ power on feel pump - you will be able to feel motor operating.

If it is clogged and you attempt to run it for any length of time, it will kill the pump.

[32eml24]

If I'm understanding correctly, you're explaining how to check if the livewell pump will draw in water? It does draw in water, I just don't see anywhere for it to flow back out if I fill it all the way up.  Or will it just sit in there and my livewell holds still, non-flowing water?  The boat I always used before circulated it back out and into the lake, and I was wondering if mine should do the same.  The other part of that question was is it normal that it does somehow draw water in without the pump being on? Whenever I check the livewells they are full up to about water level.  Plugs are in at the bottom of each side too, so I was curious if this is normal for an older style livewell or if there's something wrong with my boat's plumbing.  Maybe I wasn't clear in my explanation or maybe I misunderstood your reply but either way thanks for reading the post and helping, that's still good to know.

[Waterfoul]

Water in the livewell is normal.  In fact... pop a cover while going backwards and I'll bet you find they fill up quite quickly... most boats do (at least that's what I've observed).  This can actually be a good thing... if a pump fails during a tourney you can fill and "swap" the water by driving backwards (been there, done that).  The drain for the livewell is usually WAY up at the top... I have to stick my head in the livewell to see mine... can't be seen unless I do.  Grab a flashlight and try it... bet you find a 3/4-1" drain hole at the top.

As for the bilge pump... check the hose between the pump and the side of the boat.  Nearly had my boat sink this year during a nasty rain storm because even though the pump worked (for a while) the hose was completely plugged with "guck" from years of pumping dirty bilge water out of the boat.  I made a snake like a plumber would have and cleaned mine out.  I'd say I pulled about 10" of nasty crap out of that tube.  You could try some compressed air too... take the hose off the pump and blow from the bilge OUT of the boat... if you do it the other way you might fill your bilge with all that "guck."

Where do you live?  If you're close I could stop over with my home made snake and help you out.

Mike

[32eml24]

You rock.  That makes me feel a lot better about the livewell, looked in and there sure is a hole for discharge.  Haven't had time yet, but I plan on trying to backflush that tube from the discharge side and see if any water comes out the bilge in the bottom of the boat.  If not, then I've got the issue pinpointed and I'll definitely ahold of you if I can't figure a way to get the gunk out... killer.  Thanks for the words of wisdom!

[djkimmel]

Many of the older boats had the livewell and/or bilge pumps under battery trays and things. You may have to take a few things out and open a panel or two to get at your pumps. You could have a blockage in the bilge or broken vanes on the actual pump or maybe something stuck in the pump too where it can't build up enough push to get the water out through the hose. Pumps only last so long once you start using them.

You should have at least two bilge pumps I hope. I think 3 for anyone who fishes the Great Lake is a good idea. I carry a home spare emergency pump that I've use a time or two and loaned out a number of time. Pump on the end of a long hose - 6 to 8 feet. A long wire with a switch and two alligator clamps. I can hook those to a battery and put the motor into some water, running the long hose out of the boat. Flick the switch and voila! Bilge pump (or rod locker pump or backup livewell filler/emptier)!

It is common for fishing line or lure chunks and other gunk to get caught in your livewell valves so they don't work completely right, or to get caught in the bottom of the bilge pump or motor so it can't pump at all or hard enough to push water. Good idea to start getting in the habit of cleaning line and lure pieces up off the bottom of the boat floor.

[t-bone]

My livewell system has a valve switch for - empty, recirc, and auto.
If it is on empty - the value is open for water to flow either direction. If the boat is in the water, it will fill the livewell up about 30% - nice way to get water in the livewell without running any pumps or if the pumps aren't working. If the boat is out of the water, the water from the livewells will drain.
Sounds like that is what you are seeing with the livewells filling.

[djkimmel]

He might have the old 2-way valves. My boat is a 1993 and it originally only had 2-way valves. I put 3-way valves in after my flappers started getting stiff.

[t-bone]

That sounds like too much information - do we really need to hear about your stiff flappers 

He might have the old 2-way valves. My boat is a 1993 and it originally only had 2-way valves. I put 3-way valves in after my flappers started getting stiff.

[djkimmel]

I was regretting it as soon as I reread what I wrote... but sometimes you just have to go with it!

[32eml24]

LOOKED at it today, looks like I'll have to remove the  gas tank or battery tray, we'll see.  Haven't had time to monkey with it yet but when I do I'll post my findings.  Lots of open water around here!  3 more months...

[32eml24]

Just got finished monkeying around with my boat in the garage.  As far as the livewell, I can see the tube that runs from the back of the boat and into the top of the livewell, thus causing the water level in the livewell to equalize with the water level outside of the boat.  My question is, is there a one way valve I can install in that line so water only flows out once it's full in the livewell but does not flow into the livewell from outside the boat?  And as far as the bilge pump, it looks like there are 2 back there.  1 that has a hose coming off it to suck up the water and another that is screwed into the bottom of the boat with the discharge line leading out the side.  I flipped my switch.  The one I heard working (I mentioned I could hear it running) was the "secondary" pump, mounted a bit higher up with a free floating hose connected for suction.  I'm sure the water level has never been that high, and even if so, the pump discharges the water straight out a vent looking thing in the back.  The pump mounted on the floor wasn't connected!  I found 2 other wires not connected, coming from the main harness, same colors, so I connected them.  Nothing.  Connected the wires from the pump to a battery, turned right on.  Dropped the pump in a bucket of water, shot water right out the side and soaked my toolbox.  Just to make sure, put it back down in the bottom of the boat, filled it with water, and connected it to 12V again.  It didn't work at first, so I had to add another bucket.  Then when it did work, it went in splurges.  There was water leaking out of the top of the pump every time it splurged, so I pushed down on it and then I had a constant stream.  Shut it off, and connected it again, while holding down the pump.  Nothing.  Let a little water leak out of the pump, creating some back pressure in the line and it started sucking water again.  Didn't notice any damage on the impeller at all.  So I'm thinking I need a new pump, and I'll splice that one into the same wiring the secondary one is using so they both flip on when I hit my bilge switch.  Does that sound right?  Tried my best to paint a clear picture with my words as I don't have my camera at the moment but I can post pictures if necessary.
Ethan

[32eml24]

Update: I have everything figured out, one more simple question before I start reworking all my wiring and plumbing.  The switch for my livewell has an auto setting and a manual setting.  The auto doesn't work.  I'll figure out why not... wiring, switch, fuse whatever, I'm just wondering what it DOES? Is it better for keeping fish alive?

[Redbone]

Update: I have everything figured out, one more simple question before I start reworking all my wiring and plumbing.  The switch for my livewell has an auto setting and a manual setting.  The auto doesn't work.  I'll figure out why not... wiring, switch, fuse whatever, I'm just wondering what it DOES? Is it better for keeping fish alive?

The auto is usually ran through some sort of timing control. It will turn on and off every so often. On my Ranger it has a knob that spins to adjust the amount of time that the livewill pump will run.  The manual side is usually just on or off control. On my boat, I have read that the knob to adjust the timing is usually the first thing short out. 

One night while tinkering with my wiring I noticed my auto side had a short or a faulty switch... exc....  It only stopped for a split second. But that was enough for me. I got real nervous about having a faulty switch. I then disconnected the livewell pump wiring and wired it directly to the battery with an in line switch. I had that switch stick out of the hatch just enough to toggle it back and forth and not be in the way. With that being said, I am planning on hooking it back up this spring when I get time.

IMO your pumps are one of the most import pieces in tourney fishing. If you cant keep your fish alive, you have lost before you started.  And your bilge might not be used as much, but when you do, It can be a life saver.

[djkimmel]

The auto timer for the livewell is usually adjustable for settings between on 1 minute, off 1 minute to on 1 minute, off 5 minutes or something similar to that. If you find the timer nob, adjust it to 1 minute or shortest interval. Turn on the auto and wait at least 2 or 3 full minutes before you decide it isn't working.

If you put both bilge pumps on one wire, I'm not sure what you'll have to do about your fuse? Two pumps on one switch may require a fuse change to a high amperage but then I'm not sure if that protects if one pump shorts out somehow? If you leave the fuse as rated for one pump, you may be blowing fuses this year?

Other than backing up your boat fast on purpose, water should not be coming into your livewell from the outflow end. It should be coming in from the intake hose. There are valves you can buy that have stiffer flappers that stop water from flowing in on it's own when you have the valve set in recirc mode usually, though I have not looked at valves in a while and some brands or setups seem to alleviate water coming in unless you want it too better than others.

My 3-way valves I put in a while ago allow about 1/3 of the livewell to fill while on fill without turning on the pumps. They don't get any water or hardly any water in if I put them on recirc unless I turn the pumps on but they really designed to fill on the fill setting and then leave on fill to keep replacing overflow with new water from the lake. Or fill the livewell on fill and then switch to recirc to just keep recirculating only the water in the system and not replacing any water that goes out the overflow. I only used this in the parking lot of trailered weigh-ins or when I went from main lake areas to shallow stagnant water areas.

To be kind to my bass, I used large pill bottle caps to cap off the overflow hole to keep the water right to the top of the well. No room for bass to flip out of the water and smack the lid that way. I often got comments from tournament directors about why my bass were in such good shape no matter how rough out it was.