Michigan Bass Season POLL

[Genie]

thedude for president!

[thedude]

i could finally enact "dude doctrine" - it's long and complicated, but the gist of it is mandatory sterilization for a whole lot of people.

[Skulley]

i could finally enact "dude doctrine" - it's long and complicated, but the gist of it is mandatory sterilization for a whole lot of people.

We all probably know someone that we think fits the "dude doctrine".       




BD.                       

[djkimmel]

The problem with those kinds of policies is sometimes the people on your list have you on their list. What if their list goes first? It can get real ugly.

[Mojo]

Well folks, since I last checked in we have had 23 more voters. Here is where we stand as of memorial day, the official opening day of bass fishing season, and we have the data the speak to how the bass fishing community feels. These are not my words, but yours as a community:

* A super majority - over 90% of bass fishermen in Michigan would like to see the rules change to allow some form of C&R season in the spring. 21% of those, are even willing to pay for it.

* Of the 91%, 54% believe that allowing the bass to be removed from their beds does not have an effect on overall bass population while 46% believe some restriction should be in place to keep the bass on their beds.


Now looking at this split tells me a few things. First the overall education of bass fishermen, and how they view their quarry, has rapidly increased.

It also shows that the voice of a few is not in control of the minds of many. (happens all the time in every facet of work, government, and recreation).

It shows that completely removing regulation is not going to make 50% of the fishermen happy, but allowing some form of C&R all season will make over 90% of them happy.

Because it is now approaching June, this will quiet down, however, its time to take this data and proceed to the next step and draft a proposal.

[jmoore9543]

It is probably a good time to get this subject going again. Seems everyone forgets about this until they can't fish in the spring. What can we do this winter to get this going?

[djkimmel]

Tell your friends, family, co-workers, other anglers, anyone who might be willing to listen that the existing decades of study do not support the necessity of a closed season for bass. That a closed season just takes away fishing opportunity from anglers like you who want to fish whenever they can. That allowing more fishing would not harm the bass and would help the economy.

Lots of people need to know that lots of other people want to go fishing. You could tell your elected officials too - in writing is best. If they hear it fairly often, it may smooth the path out for people who will have to write the papers and go to all the 'required' meetings to try to bring our old-fashioned, overly conservative ways into the light of the modern era.

If someone tries to argue with you about their grampa or their brother's sister-in-law's uncle's dog trainer's friend told them our season is why bass fishing is so good here mention that 44 states out of 49 don't have a statewide closed bass season and that people have been fishing for bass out of season by accident and on purpose for over 30 in Michigan with no change to our bass season prior to the last catch and release change, yet our bass fishing got a whole lot better when we went to the 14 inch limit not because of, or in spite of any season change. Cleaner water, clearer water (partly due to regulation and partly due to invasives) also occurred during the period our bass fishing has gotten a lot better.

The season has not changed in 40 years other than they gave us a few more weeks catch and release bass fishing. Yet these are the good ole days of bass fishing! There is no correlation to better bass fishing statewide and at population levels due to our closed season but there are correlations to the improved water quality and the change to the 14 inch limit. That was the only correlation the Michigan research biologist who did the last bass season study told me they could make.

I also know there are studies that state closed season are generally only really successful at taking away fishing opportunity not improved fishing, especially for bass. Which is just one of many reasons 44 states out of 49 do not have a statewide closed bass season including Ohio, Indiana, Pennsylvania and New York. The last bastions of fear of change are Michigan, Wisconsin (who actually allows catch in keep in one part of the state before the bass start spawning because the people in that part of the state consider bass a nuisance species), Minnesota, Maine and Ontario. There are other Canadian provinces with some good bass fishing and closures, but our problem rests on the above states and the one province as the reason we 'have to be different.' Fear of change and dislike of bass tournaments are the bulk of the real issue, not biology or studies.

So get the word out. We need people telling their local MDNR, their state elected officials and especially every Michigan citizen who might care that we are tired of waiting and we want to bass fish all year like pretty much all of the rest of the country. Getting lots of people to think more bass fishing is okay is what gave us the extra few weeks of fishing last time. I can't stress that part enough.

[Waterfoul]

It just dawned on me that Representitive Tom Hooker is an old teacher and wrestling coach of mine that I keep in touch with... I have one of his re-election signs in my front yard as a matter of fact.  WHEN he gets re-elected I'll bring this up to him.

[djkimmel]

Ask him if he is on board now and if he promises he is, help him get re-elected!

[Waterfoul]

He's an outdoorsman... probably not as much now as before he became a Rep, but I'm sure he'd be onboard.

[Rangerman]

Well guys not being a resident of the Great State of MI, here my two cents anyhow If that can't work do a Catch and Release for bass all year, and a very very short keep em season. Most bass fishermen release there fish or in some case, bag em, weigh em pay em and then release Increasing fees does nothing but give more of you hard earned money to DNR to buy more No Power Loading Signs I purchase a Non Resident every year to fish most times 12 days a year, plus the DNR Ramp use permit, so I do have a dog in the fight. Believe me year long catch and release or delayed release works here in the South it has worked since the first fishing reg put in place. I do wish we had a pure catch and release during the summer months due to it's hard to keep the bass alive long days for a tournament weight in, but our fishermen have adapted to over come this by carring 20-40 lb of ice in sealed bags in the live well. All the years I have fished MI I just catch em and some case weigh em in the boat and release em on the spot. Y'all got a great bass fishery don't over regulate it. Hope to be back on Saint Clair again for a few weeks in the catch and release season.

[LennyB]

Catch and instant release open year round.

Catch and delayed release/kill from after the spawn (July 1st to March 1st).

[Waterfoul]

Catch and instant release open year round.

Catch and delayed release/kill from after the spawn (July 1st to March 1st).

I don't believe that was one of the choices in the poll.  Besides, what you propose would not be economicaly feasable.  The state would lose a LOT of money from out of state anglers and the many, many tournaments that are run in the month of June.

[djkimmel]

It never hurts to have people share their opinions.

Probably thanks to In-Fisherman and a few other sources such as dedicated ice anglers, there was also a building concern that allowing people to keep, or even catch bass during the winter would also be detrimental. Not much study-wise to back that up other than some concern in Minnesota about one river smallmouth study that stated a lot of bass were 'vulnerable' because they stacked up in one hole in the river.

Minnesota basically dropped catch and keep for smallmouth bass statewide to catch and release after early September because of that 'concern.' I talked to one of the biologists involved in that about how they came to that decision. I'm not a fan of taking away any opportunity in fishing if there isn't real good, strong evidence, preferably proof, that it is necessary, yet Minnesota and Ohio both have done that.

Something is wrong. We better do something. That was the real short version of how it happened in Ohio. What is the good of doing something if you have no idea if it will accomplish the reason you say you are doing it. Of course, big deal because all it did was kill a very good popular bass tournament season stretch there. No loss. Other than to the businesses that were making money (and providing jobs) that lost all that additional revenue. And maybe more fishing license sale loss due to less reasons for people to buy them... Other than that... who cares.

[LennyB]

I'm all for whats "best for the fishery" and keeping it healthy for all to enjoy, tournament and non-tournament folks alike. As far as the state making money, they have plenty of ways to do that.

[djkimmel]

Definitely what is best for the fishery, any fishery, is getting more people into fishing, buying fishing licenses. Anglers and hunters pretty always do more for wildlife than anyone else. Especially need more anglers in Michigan where fishing license sales are down 30% over the past dozen years. There's not much left of our MDNR and I don't see that changing a lot anytime soon the way things are being done so far.

Tournament fishing is one of the few growth areas in fishing. Shame a few Northern states that need angler growth are basically anti-bass tournament, even when it involves programs like college and high school fishing. Hurts all of us when government decisions are made by things like 'fishing is meant to be a contemplative sport not competitive' rationale I hear.

What I've always thought is so great about fishing is that there are so many different ways to enjoy it that it can meet the expectations of a wide range of persons. As long as enough people and the MDNR are willing to realize that too. Within the law, there's no such thing as a more preferred 'type' of angler or more preferred 'type' of hunter. There's just anglers and hunters.

The outdoors is critical to Michigan's economy, especially our future economy. Anything, including bass tournaments, that adds to our natural resource economy is a good thing we need and can use as far as I'm concerned.

[djkimmel]

I'm all for whats "best for the fishery" and keeping it healthy for all to enjoy, tournament and non-tournament folks alike. As far as the state making money, they have plenty of ways to do that.

I see now that I was not clear enough about 'the state.' We may be talking two different things. What I am referring to is all the businesses and companies that rely partially or quite a bit on outdoors-related activities to be a successful business. Many of those companies are taking quite a beating in this economy and more so depending upon weather patterns (businesses that rely heavy on ice fishing) and decreased participation in the outdoors.

In the old federation, we actually surveyed this in the past - how much anglers were spending for practice and during the tournament for our bigger state events and the state championship. We also asked if the participant had previously fished the area, and if not, would they now plan on returning in the future - maybe how many times for how many days.

Both B.A.S.S. and FLW Outdoors have lots of information on this type of thing too. We found out that the average state championship (back when we drew 100+ boats like the national events do) was pumping ~$140,000 directly into the each local economy. We also found out that a good number of our anglers now intended to make X number of return fishing days to a new lake, even bringing other anglers along with them, and about how much additional money that meant down the road to the local economy.

There are also plenty of studies that demonstrate overall angler behavior as far why they are more likely to buy a fishing license in a particular year, or the reasons many of them decide to skip this year altogether. The MDNR has some of this same information.

There is also a company that specializes in providing detailed reports to many states about how to increase angler participation. These are often very big, long studies. I have read all of the public ones I can get my hands on. There are many similarities and some state/region specific differences.

When I talk about more large bass tournaments being good for Michigan, I am basing it on the data I have from our past surveys in Michigan, B.A.S.S. data, FLW Outdoors data, information contained in these studies from the specialty company, information contained in numerous studies done by various DNRs and citizen advisory groups AND the heads of recognized leadership companies in the industry who explain to me how fishing participation, or lack of fishing participation, from various angler types directly impacts the success of their business.

Frankly, these are incredibly tough times for a big chunk of the outdoors industry right now, from the local 'Ma and Pa' tackle shop to the biggest companies, and very tough from many DNRs, with the Michigan DNR right about leading the pack of the departments getting hit the hardest. ANYTHING that I feel positively impacts all of that and these parties is a good thing in my book. I definitely feel more bass tournaments positively impacts our Michigan economy, AND even our MDNR, whether or not they agree.

Our bass are fine. There's a ton of fishing opportunity, and not just in bass, being left on the table by incredibly out-dated thinking. I don't have much time to work on that right now, but the time I have to work against that is time well spent. As one Michigan outdoors business leader recently put it to me, 'this nonsense with some in the MDNR being anti-bass tournament is [bs] and I'm sick of it!' He wants to be successful in business and anything that makes that harder right now than it already is, is something that is broken and needs to be fixed.

[djkimmel]

Unfortunately, the simple truth of our Michigan bass fishing season dilemma, besides the ever present fear of change, is that some key people are against adding more bass fishing simply because they don't want more bass tournaments, and they are willing to say just about anything to keep all bass anglers from getting more bass fishing just to try to stop anglers from being able to fish more bass tournaments even if that is what the anglers, who buy the licenses and the boat gas and the fishing tackle that makes their job possible in the first place, want to do.

Bass tournament anglers are real anglers, just like any other angler. The MDNR should be in the business of treating all anglers as important to their mission, not just the ones some of them like. They are in no position to be thinking things like this type of angler is desired, but this type isn't. Or this type of hunter is desired, but this type isn't. They are in the position that they need EVERY SINGLE angler and hunter they can get!

[Rangerman]

Well Bass Tournament bring alot of money into the area and the local business. In turn creates jobs and pay more tax to the Great State. You guys got a great fishery and in favor of anything that protects it. Increasing fee's is not one of them. I you tuff enough to go out on the ice have at it , If you tuff enough to go out in 15-20 mph winds in freezing rain and snow, have at it. We don't need more laws just more ramp you can power load on,  Thats a joke guys. See y'all again in the spring of 13 during the C&R season.

[djkimmel]

I'd like more ramps built 'right' too - not joking!