Coast Guard boarding today.

[Mike S.]

I was out on Muskegon this morning with my dad. During a run across the lake, I was stopped by the Coast Guard. I wasn't doing anything wrong, it was just a routine check. After checking everything, he asked for my throwable.  I have one, it was just in the port side rod locker. He told me that it HAS to be on deck at all times. They told me to sit on it while driving. Has anybody else ever heard that?

[djkimmel]

Some of the Coast Guard, and even other law officers, will say things like that. The actual regulation reads that it has to be readily available without defining it much beyond that. There are also references to being attached to a rope (so you can pull someone overboard back in?) and I have a floating rope of 25 to 50 feet (can't remember the exact length I bought but it was mentioned somewhere in a safe boating manual) tied to the handle.

I keep mine in the front compartment and the few times I've had a law officer tell me something similar I explain to them that my understanding is that the throwable has to be readily available, and I can pull out my throwable and deploy it in a matter of a few seconds as the references recommend.

If they push the issue I mention that having a loose cushion sitting anywhere where someone can accidentally step on it or trip over it in an open, shallow boat like mine is more likely to be the cause of someone falling overboard.

I've never had much discussion after that though a couple times when the officer seemed to be having a bad day or whatever the issue might be and they still told me I had to keep it out in the open I asked them if they could quote that actual language of the regulation. It's risky to irritate someone with 'authority' and a gun, but it's not much nicer to interrupt my rare fishing days with some kind of power trip or whatever that isn't making the world any better or safer... just my opinion. So I occasionally take risks.

In general, this rarely happens over the decades of my boating but sometimes we collide when all the wrong things are aligned and a quick interruption becomes something more. If possible, I try to avoid that, just not at all costs (I'm a redhead... we sometimes can't help ourselves... ).

I always recommend being courteous and patient whenever stopped. I also won't say don't ask questions in a polite and courteous manner if things start getting 'weird.' That doesn't always help... but it should be okay to ask questions.

Of course, nothing I say, or that is posted on GreatLakesBass.com constitutes legal advice or is guaranteed to help anyone in any legal encounter or that what is posted is an accurate and true representation of present law and regulations.

[motocross269]

The Macomb county sherrif that tore me down at Harley Ensign insisted it had to be out with a rope....Luckily my Jag had a place for it under the console...My Puma doesn't have a place for it and I sure wish it did because i am back to running with it in the rod locker...

Mr Laporte was with me that day that we got to talk to the Sherrif....It wasn't pretty to say the least...

I am very nervous about having anything out with a foot throttle.....If it isn't stowed there is a good chance for it to make it's way up under the throttle and it may not be able to return...

I had a sherrif give me a hard time on an inland lake about me still having the plastic covering on my throwable.........It would still float...GEEEZ!!!

[djkimmel]

Not sure I've ever left the cover on one, but I have had at least one previous 'lecture' from a Macomb County deputy about my throwable. I have been told multiple variations by multiple law agencies. That particular deputy was the one I won't forget because I was the farthest in boat near shore in mid-central west Anchor Bay, I was the only bass boat and he idled all the way through a pack of at least 30 other 'kinds' of boats to spend 30 minutes going through my boat.

He had all kinds of small issues that weren't actually regulations or laws, just things he was apparently unhappy enough about the stop me from fishing for 30 minutes so I could listen to him.

It was a long time ago but after watching him idle back out after he was done with me through the big pack of walleye/perch boats checking no other boats than mine, some of which looked like good candidates for questioning their Great Lakes preparedness, I felt a little like I had a bass boat target on my back once again...?

Since it was a long time ago I won't hold it against anyone who stops me on the water now. Unless I start feeling special again... Thank goodness it doesn't happen very often, but I am surprised once or twice a year when I find out how little some of these various law officers know about our little world.

That particular day I was in 'trouble' from the moment the deputy stopped me from fishing so I didn't say much but I did ask him what exactly the throwable regulation was and who through. I believe he said it was federal and that the throwable had to be reachable within a certain number of seconds - I think he said 3...?? Which I easily did when I got it out for him the first time.

Having loose light objects sitting in a fast moving open boat is not safe. Having something sitting around that can easily trip someone in a low draft open boat is not safe.

Since the boat manufacturers all pretty much follow marine industry standards if they really felt they needed to be creating a 'holding' spot for a throwable to keep their customers following laws and enjoying their boat I would expect all bass boats to have such a spot. Since the regulation is not that clear I expect everyone is fine the way it is except a few law officers having the occasional bad day.

Until I hear differently from a good natured law officer who can show me in writing somewhere official that proves otherwise I just leave it at that and make sure I know where the throwable is and how to grab it. I haven't needed it yet because the only one who generally falls out of my boat is me... when there's no one around to throw me the throwable (I'm trying to stop that).

[Manxfishing]

Let's face it
There's more then a few that are clueless. Not to take away from what they do
But they are the law and in charge on the water

I myself keep it in the front storage. And i do have the 25' of rope on it
There's no way I'm sitting on it. I have a life jacket
I know the guy down at LSC doing the GC checks has no problem with it being stored.

I've seen were they harassed people about with the kicker they were over the Max. HP
Have had them check the hieght of the numbers on the boats.
And one guy didn't like the outline color of the numbers?

Just stay calm, Say yes sir and they usually move on
If you need to talk about any thing, there's the weather, sports or how the fish are biting

[djkimmel]

Exactly the techniques I start out with. Most of the time I get to end with those techniques. Not always. But most of the time.

There are enough vague laws and regulations that just about everyone is susceptible to 'what someone else told them'...

[dartag]

I was stopped in Canada a couple years ago.  The officer said I needed a rope attached to the throwable.  Also a back up bailing device.  I had a small pail that was my son's when he was 2 or 3.   The officer liked it and said it would do. 

They are just doing there job.  Remember they get to pull the dead bodies out that we see on the news.

[djkimmel]

I have 2 or 3 manual balers in the boat. I've had experience in using them...

The past few seasons have been a little different in what you might be told on the Canadian side as far as requiring whatever is required where you come from verses meeting their requirements. What would we do if things didn't change.

They don't always do the rescues. One day between 11 Mile and 10 Mile my fishing partner and I had to pull in a father and young son after 'dad' flooded the ole jet ski in 63F water. They were becoming hypothermic after spending over an hour in the water next to their barely floating jet ski.

We could see them waving a long way off and there were probably 20 boats within reasonable sight including a Macomb County Sheriff boat. We pulled them into our boat, gave the youngster a towel and dry clothes to change into and had towed their barely floating jet ski half way to shore before the Sheriff's boat came over and offered to take over.

It was another one of those weird 'what the?' kind of days out there that happen every so often. 'Dad' told us he had been yelling and waving at boats that ran by as close as 30-40 feet the whole time they'd been in the water and no one would stop - we watched 2 or 3 boats run by on plane before we motored over. You could see everyone that ran by looked right at them.

The Sheriff boat watched us the whole time we were pulling them out of the water and while we hooked up and towed the jet ski that half way to shore before they motored over.

Maybe they thought dad and son were swimming? A half mile off shore?? Who knows. We didn't ask.

[djkimmel]

I was looking at A Boater's Guide To The Federal Requirements For Recreational Boats (PDF) online Coast Guard document and here's what it says about the throwable device (from page 9-10):

"Any boat 16 feet and longer (except canoes and kayaks) must also carry one throwable (Type IV) device."

Always check and read the manufacturer's information booklet and label provided with all life jackets. They will provide valuable information, including size, type, intended use, and Coast Guard approval information.

Life jackets must be:

• U.S. Coast Guard-approved (check the label).
• In good and serviceable condition.
• Appropriate size and type for the intended user.
• Properly stowed.

Stowage

• Wearable life jackets must be readily accessible.
• You should be able to put them on in a reasonable amount of time in an emergency (vessel sinking, on fire, etc.)
• They should not be stowed in plastic bags, in locked or closed compartments, or have other gear stowed on top of them.
• Throwable devices must be immediately available for use. They should be on the main deck within arm's reach, hanging on a lifeline, or other easily reached location.

[Mike S.]

They stopped me strictly on a routine check. I wasn't going to argue with them. It was a weird stop. Here's the rest of the story.

As they approached my boat, I told them I have a cpl license, and that I was carrying. He asked where it was. I told him my right hip, and that my wallet was in my right back pocket. I was instructed not to make any moves for it. I then helped them tie up to my boat.

The officer then tells me to turn around and walk to the other side of my boat because he was going to board. That's where it got weird. I did so, and was then instructed to put my hands on my head, widen my stance, and lean forward. Next thing I know, my shirt comes up and he takes my pistol. Another officer unloaded it and put it in their boat. We went through the drills, and he then printed me up a slip saying I was good to go.

While they were printed ting the papers, the other officers, there were 6 total, we're talking to me about my gun. Then we talked about children driving boats.

As for life jackets, I had 1 vest and 2 inflatables on board. All of which were in the front storage with my throwable. The laws are different on inflatables now. They now count as a life jacket and don't have to be worn at all times.  But they still were not on deck, and it didn't matter. They only were worried about the throwable.

I have to admit, I was shaking when he took my gun, and for about an hour after. It's not a good feeling when a man takes your pistol from you from behind. They gave it back, but insisted I leave the slide locked until they were gone. I'm sure glad I do my best to obey the law. That could have been a rough stop.

[djkimmel]

Too bad you didn't have all that on video. It could have made for one entertaining fishing adventure video!

I hadn't heard the laws on inflatables changed? I've been told fairly recently that they still don't count if you're not wearing them. Though I'm never surprised about a few contradictions when talking to various agencies. Pretty much par for the course. I guess I need to contact a few agencies and get a spokesperson answer about the inflatable topic. I did see (I should remind people just in case) that you have to be 16 or older I believe to use an inflatable. Better double-check that for Michigan anyway before you take my word for it.

The language in the guide is about the same for all life jackets so I still don't know why some law officers single out the throwable?? It has happened just enough over the year that I wonder if there is a seminar or something they take that stresses that?!?

I've seen a number of times when someone wearing their life jacket or not contributed to falling overboard, a boat sinking or some similar minor accident verses tragedy. I don't think I've ever seen anyone deploy a throwable in an emergency situation. I think it is extremely rare in the case of our kind of boat - open and low to the water. It probably is a little more common with bigger, high-sided boats. Maybe..?

The gun part is a great example of one reason why I'm not going to get one. I have had way too much fun already with law officers over the years. I don't need to add a hand gun to the fun. Considering what has happened over the years I don't know if I would survive a similar encounter with a gun added to the confusion and weirdness...??

You're a law-abiding citizen and yet because you have a permitted and legal gun you end up feeling more like a dangerous criminal. I can understand that some law officers would be very wary but having you turn around and put your hands on your head only to have the pistol taken from you that way would frankly put me on the wrong side of ticked off at the very beginning of the encounter. If you're fine and safe to have the gun 5 minutes before you run into them and 5 minutes after you're safe and okay to have the gun while their there. Worse comes to worse you know how to safely put your gun somewhere where it is temporarily out of the formula but still your legal gun in your possession.

It would be slightly more likely to go downhill from there as soon as they started nitpicking about anything else for me after being treated like that (might be the redhead thing?). I understand they have a job to do and it can be tough at times but that won't stop me from asking questions and even disagreeing if I'm sure I'm right and they're wrong. There's better things to do with their time AND my time than some of this.

I'm glad you're taking it fairly well but I would have been ticked off probably the rest of the fishing trip too. Being a redhead, I might have even called a supervisor later to ask if that is the normal protocol or should it be handled different, and let him/her know that I don't think it should be done that way. The stop could have easily gone differently. I'm glad for you and them that it didn't. Fishing is supposed to be fun!

Calling and telling someone at the home office make no difference. Might make a difference. Don't know until you try.

[Waterfoul]

The laws have changed on SOME inflatables.  You have to have the correct inflation valve.  If I had my catalog here at home I could tell you the name of the valve (all inflatables are not made with the same inflation valves).  The ones Mike has qualify under the new rule.

[djkimmel]

Whose rule is it? Do you know where it was released because I missed it somehow?

[LAPORTE]

I was stopped on Belleville last week buy the coast guard (yea I said Coast Guard).... the only thing they got me on was not having 3 finger width of space between the numbers and letters on the MC numbers.... go figure.... It was during the week I thought they were just board...

[Mike S.]

I was going to say Waterfoul knew about the change for inflatables. He's the one that told me about it.

Yeah, I wasn't real happy about being disarmed in the manner I was. I was thinking to myself "What did I do wrong? I was told by the Police officer at my cpl class that I could carry on my boat,  but these guys are acting like I'm being taken in to custody".  There were a  outlet of smaller fishing boats nearby, and they sat and watched the whole show. It was embarrassing. I know one thing, I will never carry on LSC.  Not having seen the Boarder Patrol out there too. You would think that after I showed my license they would have figured I was good to go. I went through the class, was able to pass the gun board's criteria to carry a concealed weapon, so why mess with me like that?

[dartag]

Them fish on Muskegon so bad you need to carry? 

With that many on the boat they may have been doing some training so you became the class of the day.

[Mike S.]

I'm cool with it. I know they were just doing their job. If I was their class, they got a good one with the pistol involved.

[Mike S.]

Them fish on Muskegon so bad you need to carry? 

With that many on the boat they may have been doing some training so you became the class of the day.

It's not that it's that bad, I just like to carry, because I can. Funny comment though!  We have gangster bass!  Meaner than a smallmouth. Lol!

[Waterfoul]

OK, I just read the new regs (*they are in the West Marine catalog on page 165) issued by the Coast Guard and I was not entirely correct with Mike Szot.

And I quote:

"water activated automatic inflatables with non-1F inflators have to be worn to be counted in the vessels inventory of PFD's."

Our own Coastal Series (which is what Mike and I have) do not fit into this category (sorry Mike).  So the Coasties that pulled him over weren't up on the new regs I guess.

[Genie]

I was out on Muskegon this morning with my dad. During a run across the lake, I was stopped by the Coast Guard. I wasn't doing anything wrong, it was just a routine check. After checking everything, he asked for my throwable.  I have one, it was just in the port side rod locker. He told me that it HAS to be on deck at all times. They told me to sit on it while driving. Has anybody else ever heard that?

Was their throwable on the deck?