Big Team Trail in Michigan?

[SethV]

Down south, there are many large 200+ boat team events.  Low entry fees, and excellent payouts.  Do you think something like this would ever make it in Michigan?  These don't have national affiliations, so there is not money getting siphoned off to a championship or anything, and there are often no "membership" fees.  Just 120% payback at the ramp, usually 1 in 4 or 5 boats gets a check depending on the trail.

I know Michigan has a lot fewer bass guys than the southern states.  It seems that there are hundereds of 20 - 30 boat events, why do you think there are no big ones?

I fished the Skeeter tour in Oklahoma.  120% payback.  Averaged 300 boats per event.  Check it out:

http://www.skeetertour.com/index.php

Do you think there would be demand for anything like this?  Do you think our short season just eliminates the chances for something like this because we can't spread out the events enough?

Seth

[Dan]

Ramps. Not many ramps capable of handling a tournament like that especially over here on the west side. Like you said in your earlier post you only get a few months up here to fish. Down south, it seems there is a boat in every other yard. More opportunity to fish, more anglers fish, and they can rationalize the costs a bit easier.

[1javelin]

I agree with Dan on both points.  You would have to launch multiple ramps on most of these lakes to cover that many boats, and with as many trails as there are now trying to get their little cut of the money, you would never be able to get that many fisherman together for one tourney.  Would be nice though.

[Revtro]

Hate to sound like a broken record, but I agree also on both.  However, I could see something like this working on the Great Lakes.  Plenty of ramp space in many locations.  Not sure why they couldn't draw a big crowd.  I'd fish it.  In fact, I'd be more inclined to fish something like that as opposed to something I have to pay $150 as a non-boater to fish.  I have no aspirations of becoming a pro, but I'd love to fish for more $$.  Payouts in our little 20 and 30 boat tournaments just don't cut it.  But I take what I can get I guess.

[rustydog]

It would be nice to have a tour. like that here at home. We used to fish the Sturgeon Bay Open in Wis. until you had to win to pay for your gas getting there.

[BASS FISHERMAN]

i remembur wheen TEAM MICHIGAN was arunnin an thay draw 100 pluss boat in thay tournie 
i rembur wheen TRI STATES was arunnin an thay draw 100 pluss boat 
i remembur MICHIGAN BASS FEDURATIUN was drawin 100 pluss boat in thay tournie 
WHUT HAPPUNED TO SAID TOURNIES 
maybee $3.00 gallun gass  ???maybee impropur curcit directores "OWNURS"  maybee too mannie small curcuts out thar now  WHO no FUR sure 

STRATOES BOAT RULE 

[Durand Dan]

Local Support! Whenever I fish down South the locals turn out for the events and local businesses support them. I've gone in to restaurants and had people come up and say they appreciate the impact the industry has on their economy. We don't really have that here in Michigan. I guess they believe that the Jet Skies and Pleasure boaters contribute more to their bottom line.

[OUTLAW]

There is one problem with that type of tournament in michigan. It is not that there are not ehough fisherman there are too many tournaments, Most guys around here would rather fish against the same 20 teams every week for $200.00 than fish against 200 teams for real money all you have to do is look at the rules of some of the tournaments. They state that if you are a guide or you have fished a tournament with an entry of over X amount you can't fish. The state of tournaments in Michigan is so far behind the rest of the country, and it is going backwords.

If we had about 200 less tournaments in the state we would be farther ahead but like I said most guys are happy with $200.00 pay outs and don't want to fish against the guys that fish FLW or BASS.

As far as ramps and lakes there is plenty of water and ramps on The grand and muskegon to hold 200 plus boats. The grand has 5 ramps within 10min boat ride of riverside park, and at muskegon there are 4 ramps within  10 min boat ride of fishermans.

It is not the lakes it is the local fisherman. Look at the Super bass tournament they will pay $10,000.00 for first and still can't get mare than 60 boats.

When Tri-State was around they had there Super tournament on the Grand the last year I talked to Phil at the meeting the night before and he said I am giving away a fully riged champ and I can't get more than 70 boats to show up, and that was the last year he ran tournaments.

If you want to fish the best tournaments on the west side of the state try BBT, Shoreline and OUTLAW 100% payback.

[bshaner]

Dejavu.... 

B

[rufus]

I remember the last Tri State I fished on Lake James in Indiana. We signed in late and Phil was disappointed because there were only 140 boats signed up! Those were the days. I also used to fsih the Rusty Hook here in Indiana and lower Michigan and it was nothing for the Leaziers to turn a few boats away because of the 100 boat limits. My brother and I cashed our first large check in one of these and went home with $1500 each. The classic was always a mystery lake within an hours drive of the other lakes and the 20 teams that qualified would meet at a specified restaurant for breakfast and an awards ceremony, after which we would be given the location of the 2-day classic. Sometimes it would be the same lake 2 days in a row and sometimes 2 different lakes. The largest event as far as I know is now the Lake Drive Marine circuit, they take a max field of 75 boats and are always full. It is very well run with a good payback and a lot of fun to fish and the classic is never too far away. From my perspective to get back to those 100-150 boats tourneys of yesteryear, we need a trail that 1: has an entry around $100; 2: keeps the classic close; 3: is not affiliated with any other national circuit; 4: has a 90% or higher payback with some nice prizes in the mix. It can be done, we just need someone with the abilities to get it done. Tristates were absolutley awesome back in the day. You had an opportunity to fish against guys like KVD. I would love to see it happen again! God Bless and Good Fishin'

[rustydog]

We are giving Super Bass a go this year. These old men are hoping for calm winds and smooth sailing. 100 boats would be nice.

[1javelin]

Really considered fishing the Superbass until I saw the entry fee.  With the other tourney's I'm fishing this year, only NBAA and BBT, I can't afford to throw down 250 plus 20 for big bass.  Make it 100 or 125, I probably would've went for it, but I have other things to worry about for now, like how I'm going to buy everything I need and pay tourneys and keep my wife happy at the same time.  Fishing is a challenge, even off the lake!!

[skeeterman190]

 Alright guys im gonna throw my two cents in on this conversation. I would love to see less tourneys and more boats.I fish the BBT and Shoreline. I live here in Nw Indiana and its a 2 1/2 hr drive for me to get to these lakes but id rather spend my money fishing against better competition and on better lakes, then throwing $200 away around here to fish a 1000 acre lake with 40 or 50 boats and then getting 100 dollars for a top 5 finish..Im by no means a top fisherman in these circuts but i feel that the only way im gonna get better is to fish against these top guys. Figure out the few nicks i need to fix. I know alot of you guys have families and everything and i can understand that(im 24 i make good money and im single i love life) but like with the superbass tourney okay its $135 a person but if you look at it we get more boats then hey we are gonna pay more money. (the wife would love to see $150 turn into 5 grand wouldnt she??) even without wining im sure it would be alot better money if there were 100 boats, thats some cash paid in. Just look at last years  super bass, 56 boats still paid out 11 grand add 50 more boats where does that put you?? 20 grand plus, more money for everyone. i guess im rambling on and probably not making much lead way but just remember the old saying you gotta spend money to make money.-skeeterman-

[1javelin]

If I can come up with the money by then, I may fish it still anyways.  I'm 24 and make decent money as well, but I am also married, with a house payment, 2 vehicles, a boat, and a wife that likes to shop and eat out as much as I do.  My fishing money is hard to come by, so when I can take my chance at 2 BBT tourneys for the same price as 1 superbass, my wife does the math there.  I may still show up, so don't count me out yet. 
  I totally understand your points, and agree with them.  I would much rather fish a 200 boat circuit than one with 25 boats, even if it costs a little more, because you have to do good to cash a check there.  Luck is not even half the game then.  I like that, which is why I have to get better and quit getting lucky!

[SethV]

I would love to see less tourneys and more boats.

...but i feel that the only way im gonna get better is to fish against these top guys.

Skeeterman-  You summed up my feelings nicely.  The big team trails down south drew the best in the business.  For a 200 team entry fee, you were fishing for 20 grand with the payout going very deep into the field, not just stacked at the top. 

This kind of payout attracted the best.  Edwin Evers, Tommy Biffle, Bradley Hallman, Allan Head, Jason Christie, Terry Butcher, Kenyon Hill, Ken Cook, OT Fears, Jeff Kriet were all regulars.  Sure, they are GOOD, but man, it really makes you raise your own game.  I was the newbie, so it was even harder....but what great motivaion.  And when you beat these guys, what a feeling of accomplishment.  It is no big deal to beat 30 bass clubbers, but when you beat 300 of the best locals that means something.

So how do we get it done?  Less events and larger turnouts?   

[bshaner]

I would be all in for this less tourneys more boats!!  I think it is definately the answer but how do you get it done?

I'm looking at my schedule and I could fish 4 tournaments a week with an entry fee on average of $100 and upwards of $250.  The problem with that is most of them are average 15 to 20 boats and it's win or go home empty.

I would gladly fish 10 tournaments a year tops that had an average 75+ boats with higher payouts. 

I have no problems with the way most of the tournaments are run and  I hope this thread does not turn into a "my circuit is better than your circuit arguement", because that is not what this is about. 

I like the direction the thread is currently going, let's keep it going this way!!  So how do we figure out a way to get these circuits combined into larger boat turnouts?  It seems we are spreading boats thin with so many trails to choose from.

Unfortunately I have to preach from the choir because I do not have the time nor the ambition to actually organize something like this but I would fully support it.

This is pure speculation and not based on experience or facts but I would think that it would be easier to get bigger sponsors and more $$$ from sponsors if they new they were supporting a trail that was going to draw mass numbers of anglers and have spectator driven weigh-ins.  Basically you would be doing something like the BFL's but...

On the opposite side of the coin I think you would draw more anglers because of the trail being locally sponsored and locally run but with more publicity than these smaller 20 boat tournaments.  It would take the big corporation/big business aspect out of the equation, which would promote supporting the local economy and buying from local sponsors.

Just a few thoughts off the top of my head.  More to come probably.

B

[BryanP]

I remember back 10-15 years ago we would get 40 boats for the weekly Wed Night tournaments.  They fished mainly Wamplers and Devils lakes, with no classic and no membership.  Now, there are tournaments Monday thru Friday, with multiple divisions of Midwest Sportsman and NBAA fishing the same lakes, and overlapping each other on the same nights (but diff lake).  The draw is terrible--just 5-10 boats most of the time.

So, yes, I do think there are way too many tournaments!

As for the membership fees, 100% paybacks, etc....  Just remember what a pain in the butt it is to run a major circuit.  You couldn't pay me enough to run a circuit!  But also remember that all circuits are making money, even those that boast 100% paybacks.  They just get their money up front in the form of membership fees.

[OUTLAW]

I have a way we can stop all of the little 10 -15 boat tournaments, Do like I am doing don't fish them. DOn't pay the membership, If there #'s drop maybe they will change. But the problem is you will never get the fisherman to do that. If all of the guys on this board stoped fishing tournaments that had 50 boats or less the promoters would see that there needs to be a change.

Personaly I don't see how someone can justify paying $3.00 for gas to fish a 20 boat tournament. It cost the same to fish a larger tournament and you have a chance to MAKE money not break even.

I think Brian Feutz is on the right track with OUTLAW 100% payback, as he grows he will add sponsors and with that he will draw more boats.

Why should the tournament fisherman have to make the directors rich by giving them 30 or 40% of the pot plus they get the sponsor money to, and if the circut has a boat sponsor they get a free boat to run around in for the year. I sponsor a local tournament that draws 70 to 80 boats and it cost me $750.00 a year. Now look at the sponsors the larger groups have, Strike King, Skeeter, Yamaha, Nitro, Mercury, Quantum, Triton, and other national sponsors what do you think they pay?

I have said it before I don't have a problem with directors making money I would Not do it for free, but we are the reason they have the sponsors why should we pay the price. If the tournament groups did not have 6000 memberships to show these sponsors they would tell them to get lost.

Until the fisherman get together on this nothing will get done.

How many guys would give up tournaments that take a large cut out of the pot for a year? I would I know I could put on a weekly 15 to 20 boat tournament, and I am sure there are alot of other guys that could do the same.

[thomas]

My biggest complaint, there are teams or just boaters that will not fish an entire tournament trail, but pick one lake to fish. Fish every tournament on that lake just for the check. I quess following a tournament trail means to much work finding fish.

thomas

[1javelin]

Well, my partner and I decided to fish the bigger tournaments for some of these reasons.  First, more payback spots so you can have a good day and make some money.  Second, if you do go big, you MAKE money, not break even.  Third, more competition, which makes you play the game and step up some.  And Fourth, we get sick of fishing the same little lakes with the same guys all the time.  Granted we still will probably fish some of them, especially the lakes we enjoy fishing all the time anyways, who wouldn't.  A chance to make a few bucks close to home and you would probably be out fishing anyways. 
   If somebody can get a big trail going next year, I'd be in.  We're fishing BBT, probably the biggest around from the looks of it, and NBAA, because it's national and supposed to have a good draw of boats.  We'll see what we stick to next year.