04 champion 187 questions

[korean_bassmaster]

Hey guys I have a few questions about this boat. I'm looking at a 04 champion 187 to buy in kentucky. It has a 04 175hp optimax power pole and 2 hummingbird graphs. 581hdi GPS at console. 80lb Maxum t.m. overall boat looks in good shape from pics. Seats will have to b redone and the carpet in between the driver and passage seats has some wear.  Trailer looks to b in good shape as well from pics.  New tires a month ago.  He's asking $13500. Is this a good price on this boat and also if I go look at it, what r the main areas to b concerned about?   Thanks for the help

[korean_bassmaster]

Also what questions should I ask him b4 u drive down to look at it?

[TheFishinPollock]

That sounds like a decent price. Champs hold their value and quality years past other brands.

make sure you get hours on the motor.  around 50 to 70 is normal for the average angler that fishes some tournments.
Jackplate or not and what brand.

As for concern the transom is the most important. Check the fittings and through hull boats for good sealent.  Check the bildge area.  Definatly crawl under it to see if there is any blistering of the hull from water being forced between the gelcoat and fiberglass.

Other than that i can't think of anything else without seeing the pictures.  The seats can be exact matches made at Dean canves . They were the supplier for ChampioN seats.

Have had a ChampioN all my life. either the one I have now or the 2 others i have owned in the past.  You will not believe the ride quality in it.  Make sure you test drive it in windy conditions. Not smooth and it will show you the control and  quality ride in ruff water they were designed for.

[korean_bassmaster]

He said he didn't kno the hours because it sent have a gauge.  The attachment is what he said when I asked him if he has had ne problems with the motor.  Also what does it cost roughly to have the seats redone?

[korean_bassmaster]

These r the pics I have do far. He will b sendING more tmro.

[TheFishinPollock]

That is one nice boat KB. I mean really nice. 

I'd still check what I mentioned plus ask to take it to a reputable shop around there and have a compression test done. Prolly cost ya 50 bucks.  IF he says no , walk away no matter how nice that thing is . ( I want a ride if ya come up my way this summer its so nice ). You might ask to pull the top plug on the LU and check for water. He might , might not.  I don't know if that motor has the same computer read out ability as my pro xs . Might have to go on word for hours.

Nada.com has the best used value rates around. We used them at every single auction I dealt with in the car and boat market. I did many more cars than a boat, but they seem to always have someone at a major auction keeping track of buy costs.   You might want to punch in the numbers there youself. I did it to see and hes over the average price 2 K but I never factored in the graphs or TM .

The seats, now this is just a total guess based on what mine cost that are way old style.   200 a seat.

IF everything I would check , checks out. I'd buy that boat. Might ask once if he could come down a bit , but not twice. By looks to me , it's worth the price.   

[korean_bassmaster]

So it sounds like that me asking 11500 might not b to far off?

[korean_bassmaster]

It has 2 humminbird on it now. How hard is it to switch it over to lowrance units?

[Manxfishing]

It's a very dirty boat right now
So, at 11,500 you not far apart

Being a 04 it's a Tenn boat, after they were bought by Genmar
Should be all composite (no wood)
The seats were built by Lebroc
http://pilotchair.com/cat-llebroc-bass-boat-seats.cfm

To switch from HB to Lowrance
It's the same as installing a new system but the power is there

The 187 was a really good hull
smaller & nimble but rode and fished like a 20' boat

[bwebber]

KB,

I have a 1999 Skeeter 195 for sale $14,000.00 obo.  Dual console with a brand new powerhead from Hydro Tec with a one year warranty, tandem trailer. Just as clean as the Champion you're looking at.  Northern Michigan

If interested? 989-350-1301

[Waterfoul]

Looks o.k. but I'm sure you can find a boat a lot closer to home for that price.

[MSURoss]

I agree with waterfoul. Unless you are buying a 1-3 year old boat there are several advantages of buying in Michigan. You won't be pressured to buy due to long trips, and we can't use our boats here for more that 6 months. Also it's too hard to tell a boats condition from just the pictures. You also don't have negotiation leverage if there is a minor problem with the boat because the seller knows you will have money on hand...

[korean_bassmaster]

Ya msuross i thot about that.  What questions I've asked and there was a prob with it, like seats and 3 bank charger he said he'd come down on price.  I also wouldnt make the drive unless we agreed on somewhat of a price depending on if I found out nething else wrong with it.  I'm new to buying a glass boat so I'm making sure I do it right the first time if I do deside on getting iT or when I do get one. Thanks for all the info guys.  There's things that i want in the boat im buying  (obviously ) and this one pretty much has it all but the single axe trailer and I'd like a Lil better graphs. But other than that the d.c. the 175-200hp t.m. all is right.   Soo idk mayb I'm just settling.

[LennyB]

I bought my current boat in 2004 and I looked at the 187 as well as the 188 Champs that year. The 187 was the tournament series/base model rig and it sold for $28,000 brand new out the door at D & R in Kalamazoo. The 188 was the elite series 18 footer and sold for a little over 30,000. The 187 was narrower than the 188 and was available in 4 color combos. If I remember correctly, in 2004 both rigs still had wood in the construction which moved me to a Ranger that was all composite. If you want to talk to someone with an in depth knowledge of that model, Randy at D & R is an expert on bass boats and he actually sold that model.

As for things to check, I would look for cracks, blistering as mentioned in earlier post. Look in all compartments, the live-well, the cooler, battery compartment, etc...  for stress signs. What condition is the finish in? Was it garage kept or setting in the yard. Look around at signs of how this person takes care of things. If he says it was garage kept, were is the garage, is it in one know? If it has a cover, check that out. If it is the original cover and the rig was garage kept the cover should be in good shape. Mine looks new still. If it was outside alot the cover will be faded and cracking. You would be surprised how poorly people take care of things. Some will leave their rigs setting uncovered in the yard year round. This all makes a big difference as to price. What about the condition of the motor. Is the prop bent or dinged. Plan on $180 to have a stainless prop straightened and balanced. Is the skeg bent or damaged. Is the motor on Optimax or an EFI. The Optimax was about $2000 more when new in 2004. I would also look at the trailer. I know on my boat which is also a 2004, the 10 brackets that connect the trailer bunks to the trailer just rusted out. Are his original? It cost me $350 to replace the brackets, hardware, and bunks doing it myself. What about the tires? I just bought at new set of Marathon ST215/75R14's at Belle Tire which cost $220 mounted and balanced. Check the bilge and livewell pumps for operation as well as the lights on the boat and trailer. Does the trailer wiring looked old and cracked or brittle. Look at the wear on the tires. If he hit a pot hole and bent the axle even a little, the tire tread will wear more on one side. If the trailer has cool hubs, check the site glass to see if the oil is clean or milky looking, meaning the seal is leaking. Operate the trolling motor and check overall condition. D & R charges about $180 to rebuild a 24V MinnKota. New ones are expensive to replace. They start at $400 and go up to $1100. What model trolling motor is on it and how old is it. What electronics are on it and how old are they. These are just a few things I have had to fix over the years on my 2004.

In my opinion, the value of a 2004 187 in excellent condition (like new) with middle of the road electronics and trolling motor could be $15,000 retail if the boat, trailer, and motor are in great condition. Keeping in mind the 187 retailed for $28,000 brand new that year. If the rig is in average condition it might be worth $12,000. If it is in rough shape it could be as low as $8,000. Just my opinion. Hope this helps you make a sound decision.

[jcox7]

Just remember boats from around here have been on the great lakes most boats in TN at worst have been on KY Lake but most see Douglas, Cherokee, Watts Bar Tims Ford all small reservoirs that do not have the abuse that Michigan boats get.  I would look around TN.  Find someone you trust in the area and see if they will go look before you go there.  If you don't know anyone let me know and Ill have a federation guy check for you.  Jeff@bassfederation.com

[Waterfoul]

Just remember boats from around here have been on the great lakes most boats in TN at worst have been on KY Lake but most see Douglas, Cherokee, Watts Bar Tims Ford all small reservoirs that do not have the abuse that Michigan boats get.  I would look around TN.  Find someone you trust in the area and see if they will go look before you go there.  If you don't know anyone let me know and Ill have a federation guy check for you.  Jeff@bassfederation.com

I (somewhat) disagree Jeff.  I know a LOT of bass boaters that have never ventured outside the piers or been on St. Clair.  I see them come thru my store every day.  Even my boat has only been on Lake Michigan to run from one port to another 3 times in 6 years and it was pretty nice out there every time, and you know how often I use my boat.  Granted my boat wasn't in that great a shape when I bought it, but it's in better shape now despite how much I use it.

Long and short of it is... don't buy the first boat  you look at unless it's mint and what you are looking for.  You can't be in a hurry.  Take a friend who knows a little something about boats along for a second opinion.  I've done this for several people over the years and we've found some gems and some real stinkers (often contrary to what the add said).  Shop shop shop.

[MSURoss]

Agree with waterfoul. What about the gravel bar Rick hit lol

[Mike S.]

That boat looks pretty dirty. Doesn't look too well kept. I could be wrong. My partner has an '03 Champ 196 with a 200 Opti, and I love it. It's great in big water, and fishes like a dream. I think he was thinking about selling it for 14 or 16, somewhere in there. It's WAY nicer than the dirty bird that guy sent pics of. It must be a Kentucky/Tennessee thing. A buddy of mine bought an 04 TR22 from KY. What a mess it is. He's got some $$$$ to spend to fix her up. My old Skeeter has lived it's whole life on the Great Lakes, and didn't have a single crack on it. The original owner, Slipkey, had it out in big water way more than I ever did.

[Slipkey]

Seat damage like that boat has (top of headrest and inside bucket edges), usually means a boat that has been left uncovered in the sun for long periods of time. As shiny as that top cap looks in the pictures, the difference in color between the interior gelcoat red and the topcap red would seem to bear that out.

Not a huge deal as those can be replaced and that boat doesn't have a lot of bells and whistles that are going to be affected by weather (which can be a really good thing).  Those cosmetic things can be fixed, but know that you're going to have some work to do with buffing an polishing.

Champion, IMHO, were in the top 5% of best boats ever made in their year classes (I still drool whenever I see a 206 out and about, as Hollada can attest to), so you've probably got a solid boat down there.  That year Opti is solid and proven (My 225 is the same year and has never seen the inside of a shop for anything other than routine maintenance). To be sure, though, have him pop the cowling and send you a picture of the interior of the motor.  It should be clean - really clean - and if it's not, walk away as all of the electronic harnesses are on the outside and you don't want to troubleshoot corroded connections anytime in the near future.

I'm not a fan of TI Trailers (which is what that boat sits on) but tube trailers tend to hold up better outside where there's air to dry them out than they do inside so the storing of that one outside is probably a benefit.  That one looks clean, with very little rust around the front of the frame (which is where it gets dinged most by gravel roads and debris).

Also, looks like you'll need new tires, as the right side tire I can see in the photo looks pretty worn (and unevenly so) so count that in to your cost, and maybe even alignment.

All in all, I'm going to side with Waterfoul.  I think you can find a better price on an equivalent boat closer to home, but if you're jonesing for the boat and you think this is the one, you could do much, much worse.

[YpsiBass]

Agree with waterfoul. What about the gravel bar Rick hit lol

I'm never going to be able to live that down nor are you guys going to forget about it.  If you end up buying a boat, I have a waypoint for Kent lake I'd like to share with you