American Axle

[Durand Dan]

Now here's a controversial subject. What's everyone's thought on the American Axle strike? Here's my 2 cents:

I believe the Corporations and the UAW are doing more in the space of 2 years time to eradicate the middle class than has occurred in 50 years. This benefits both the Big Three in reduced labor costs and the UAW in possible increased membership leading to more Union dues. I am not a Union member and haven't been except for about a month many years ago. However, I realize their push for wages and benefits has affected my standard of living greatly. Now with the UAW and the Big Three having joined forces anyone with a link to the Auto industry is in jeopardy of suffering the same fate of low wages and reduced or non-existent benefits.
Working for a supplier of machinery to the Auto industry I see the decline of my standard of living and my children on the horizon.

The statement by American Axle's leadership sums it all up "Why should we pay premium wages and benefits when the Union has given the Auto Companies greatly reduced labor costs?"

[motocross269]

Manufacturing is in dire straits...I don't care what you make or what you do...I feel sorry for these kids coming out of H.S. that can't afford to go to college for 6-8 years..I call it a "Draft by economics" because the Military is about the only place for some of these kids to go.
As far as the Union wages effecting other workers take home you are just seeing the beginning...The japanese companies in the south are already lowering the pay scales of their workers to reflect the changes...

[Skulley]

Keep in mind that these companies in the south are in Right to Work states.  That means that the union has to represent people that don't want to belong to the union.  Right to Work makes overall wages for everyone union and non union go down.  It also is bad for schools, cities, small business, etc.  Right to work for less is basically what Right to Work is all about.  Remember RIGHT TO WORK FOR LESS!!!!!     So if Right to Work comes to Michigan, expect a big pay cut..........and I mean a BIG PAY CUT!!!!!

Now on the American Axle subject.  The UAW will take concessions in a tough economy to "live to fight another day".  Remember that the pendulum will eventually swing the other way.  In other words when first tier wage earners are at a minority and the second tier is in the majority, union contracts will not be ratified until they get parody with the remaining first tier wage earners.  Understand also that some UAW workers are already in a tier type system.  In my local and at Chrysler LLC, we have 18 different payscales.  That means 18 different tiers.  This two tier wage thing is a challenge to hourly and skilled trade Local Unions.  Where as since I am a salary employee, we have had 18 different tiers and have had this system for............well since before I started working at Chrysler during the Iacocca days.  So this tier stuff is not new to the UAW. Especially those of us who are in the salary ranks. 

To get the REAL scoop on Right To Work click here and click here.  Please read both of these websites and then you WILL be informed.  Don't let them fool you.  Right to Work is for LESS.  It is not as good or great as it sounds.  Right to Work will be worse for the middle class than anything you can imagine.  All working people will then be refered to as the "WORKING POOR" because our wages will never keep up with the cost of living index. 

This is important that we fight against Right To Work.  It will drive our economy downward as well as our schools, our small businesses, our Chambers of Commerce, and anything else that has benefitted from people who are Union Represented.  We will have more poverty because there will be less money.  Big companies want this.  This will make our state worse than it already is.  And it is bad here.   

RIGHT TO WORK IS BAD FOR MICHIGAN!!!!

BD             

[bigjc]

I am a union member, and I am pro-union, but the Union needs a TOTAL MAKEOVER.  Maybe there will be a new reality TV show for that.  Union Leadership has become just another bureacratic entity.  They need to get out of Politics, out of bed with the DEM's, and back to work for US, the members of the Locals, and then, maybe then we will be able to keep the manufactuing workers in the middle class, and keep good workers in the union, and keep the quality of American products Great.

JC

[REEL_MAN]

The company I work for WAS UAW until 5 years ago. The union struck over retirement bennifits. The union wouldn't negociate, it was their way or no way. To make things short the union was voted out and all the members left. You say wages and bennifits would go down. Well, they didn't, they stayed the same but have increased. There are a couple major differences though.
1. the wall between managemnet and the plant isn't there, we now work as a team
2. we have now received bonus checkes 3 years in a row! Across the board, top to bottom
As JC said maybe it's time for the union management to do some reevaluation if they want to survive.
It's a shame that since one company strikes it causes hardship on so many others, is the union helping them?

REEL MAN

[dartag]

i bet the GM guys on layoff would have liked to have waited until june so they could be out fishing collecting 95 % pay.  just hope they get it settled and get everyone back to work.  this state is in bad enough shape as it is...

[Skulley]

The Union is only as strong as its members.  In other words, your union membership is its strength. 

What I would like to know is if you are involved, or are you just members that don't get involved but only stand by and complain???  I am involved.  I don't agree with all the ways but I know my vote and involvement can and will make a difference. 

So if the union is only as strong as its membership, then you have to ask yourself:
1) What kind of member am I??? 
2) Should I start going to the membership meetings??? 
3) Should I participate in the elections and the processes??? 
4) Should my union support me if I don't support it???  The fact is the union can't support you if you don't support it.

If you don't, then you shouldn't complain.  If you do, then by all means speak up or forever hold your peace..........Remember its your voice and your choice.  The fact is the union can't support you if you don't support it.  Use what the Almighty gave you.  It's up to you as a member to support your union and help make the changes you talk about bigjc.  That's why I want an elected position.  That's why I got an elected position.  Because I know I can lead my union to change for the good of all members.

That's great what worked for you REEL_MAN.  But if Michigan goes Right to Work.......Heaven forbid..........all that will change.  Did you get involved with your Union REEL_MAN.....or did you sit by??  So how are your retirement benefits now???  Do you still have benefits???  Do you believe them when they tell you that you have retirement benefits???  More of your retirement burden will be on you now.  Your company will show you that when you do retire.  Your pension won't add up to mine since you decertified.  The bonuses will not add up to what your pension would have. 



BD         

[cr]

I am pro-union , my grandfather was involved in the sit-down strike , my father was skill-trades shop comittee-man for 25yrs , and I hired in at the original chevrolet plant on chevrolet ave , flint mi , in 1977. I worked at 5 different division of GM before retiring last year , and I realize I owe everyting I have to the union . But that being said , I think its time for major changes in the way unions are operated . I watched the "BUY AMERICAN" campaign get out of control , and think the way to make america buy american made cars is to build cars that appeal to the masses . Instead of pushing buy american , I think the union should have lobbied the big 3 to produce high mpg cars , "green" cars , and better warranties , instead of hummers that get 8 mpg , hhrs ,and 2 seater buicks .Or to try and get the goverment to pass equal import /export laws . But to say a union is only as strong as its members is not quite right ether ,in my opinon . Nothing said in local union meetings seems to ever make it to the national level . The international decides what will or won't be addressed before the convention , and if a delegate tries to say something they don't want to address they simply turn his or her mic off. I've seen contracts voted down , only to have the union say this is as good as your gonna get so you better vote it in , hold another vote on the exact same contract which then passes . Hows my no vote count then? I've seen local  a Chairman lose reelection, only to get appointed to a international position , hows my vote count then ? If the membership did'nt think he made a good Chairman how did he deserve an appointed job? I realize these are isolated incidents but think they are indicative of the problems the unions face at large .The union needs a major restructuring starting at the top . Management is not a enemy , only someone trying to earn money for their family , like everybody else . I hope the union adapts to this changing world , as only those who adapt survive , just ask the dinosaurs .

[motocross269]

As a skilled tradesman at Ford...I feel like we have been left hanging by both the union and management...We are calling it skilled trades genocide at our plant...Our numbers have dropped like a rock while production numbers have stayed the same...It is starting to cost the company with increased maintenance issues and downtime..Bandaid maintenance and no PM only goes so far...

[Durand Dan]

As a skilled tradesman at Ford...I feel like we have been left hanging by both the union and management...We are calling it skilled trades genocide at our plant...Our numbers have dropped like a rock while production numbers have stayed the same...It is starting to cost the company with increased maintenance issues and downtime..Bandaid maintenance and no PM only goes so far...

Hey they still do PM. Only now it stands for Pretend Maintenance and is done at the Supervisors desk

[joshimoto son]

I must admit... when I first saw this thread come up, my first instinct was " Oh no!! this is gonna be bad."

I have had eight years experience working with union trades as a non-union project manager on large construction sites. I had no other reason to believe that this thread was going to "blow up".

Congratulations guys! You proved me wrong.

You have been a shining example of how to take a touchy subject and not let it get out of hand and in turn make it informative. Lt. Dan had pointed that out to me.

Great job.

joshimoto son

[nitrobass]

When American Axle went on strike GM had over a 150 day supply of vehicles to sell to the public. So if you look at it by GM's view it gives them time to liquidate their stock to a lower supply then they'll step in and help settle the strike.

[Revtro]

Agreed Josh.  Proud of the guys here.  This is a good example of how to have discussions about potentially divisive subjects with respect and dignity.  Well done all.

[Durand Dan]

Many years as a Skilled Trades Supervisor has given me the gift of broaching touchy subjects.

[motocross269]

As a skilled tradesman at Ford...I feel like we have been left hanging by both the union and management...We are calling it skilled trades genocide at our plant...Our numbers have dropped like a rock while production numbers have stayed the same...It is starting to cost the company with increased maintenance issues and downtime..Bandaid maintenance and no PM only goes so far...

Hey they still do PM. Only now it stands for Pretend Maintenance and is done at the Supervisors desk

You hit the nail on the head....I see you are a skilled trades supervisor..They pretty much got rid of all of our Skilled trades supervisors now we report to production...I feel like I am banging my head against the wall trying to get anything accomplished...It is an exercise in frustration..No Parts, No time, No one cares until it breaks...I go home every night wondering "what the heck are the paying me for, I accomplished absolutely nothing today no matter how hard I tried"...
Outsiders try to blame the Big 3 downfalls on the workers...Nothing could be farther from the truth..."Most" people want to do a good job and produce a good product, but Between the Management and some of the union rules it is almost impossible.  (I am 100 percent pro union I just think some tweaking is in order)

[Durand Dan]

You hit the nail on the head....I see you are a skilled trades supervisor..They pretty much got rid of all of our Skilled trades supervisors now we report to production...I feel like I am banging my head against the wall trying to get anything accomplished...It is an exercise in frustration..No Parts, No time, No one cares until it breaks...I go home every night wondering "what the heck are the paying me for, I accomplished absolutely nothing today no matter how hard I tried"...

Former GM Skilled Trades Supervisor.  I couldn't stand the way "Management" was destroying the Company by trying to lead it so I left. There is a lot wrong with the Big 3 and the Unions but it was all caused or allowed to happen by the Corporations refusal to manage.

[motocross269]

Exactly...it is not the first or even the second line leaders fault..It is way above them..I came from the military and I have never seen leaders pass the buck like they do here....The very first thing they taught us at leadership school in the military is that every organization has a few bad individuals, but if the unit is failing as a whole it falls on the leaders...not the individuals..(I am talking both union and company)
I do think there have been some improvements in the last 10 years...Mostly with quality..I know Ford and I am sure the other big 3 have made quality the number 1 concern..Hopefully it isn't to little to late..

[Skulley]

Being Union Leadership at my company has taught me that there are a whole lot of different viewpoints on a subject like this.  Being where I have been, I can pretty well tell who is pro-labor or anti-labor.  I do know this, having unions has allowed this country to survive and thrive.  As I said in an earlier post, the pendulum is swinging currently in managements direction.  In time, the pendulum will swing the other way.  It is as cyclical as the industry itself.

BD