Blessed or lucky?

[Revtro]

This is just a random thought I was having today.  I wonder how often we are blessed, but chalk it up to random chance or luck?  I was talking about this concept a few weeks ago in church when I speaking on prayer.  My premise was... even though God already knows everything we need even before we ask, there must be a reason we are supposed to pray.  The reason can't be that we need to "inform" Him of what we need because He already knows and always has. 

The conclusion I came to was that we need to pray precisely so when we are blessed, we don't chalk it up to random chance or luck.  It helps us acknowledge that it was indeed God who answered our prayer.  Of course, His answer isn't always "yes" to our prayers, but that's another topic altogether. 

Anyway, I'm really trying lately to make sure I recognize the things that God is doing in my life rather than let them go by unnoticed or attributed to luck.  It's just my opinion, but I think this is why so many people don't believe that God is real.  They haven't tried prayer and when they did, they weren't open to God's answer taking a form other than what they wanted.  So when God did move on their behalf, they didn't see it, ergo God must not exist. 

Okey doke, that's my random thought for the day I guess.  Just thinking out loud.  I do feel very blessed BTW.  God has been amazingly good to me and my family in recent months.  We've gone through some very difficult things, yet I see Him moving in our lives through it all.  It really gives me a lot of peace even though we're still having to go through difficulty. 

Thoughts?

[motocross269]

Sometimes I think I forget how blessed I truly am..and what really is important..
I came home from a tournament Sunday and was pretty much crushed with my results. I have been going through a horrible streak lately and didn't come close to any of my goals for the year..My wife and 5 year old daughter were very happy to see me win or lose....My youngest couldn't wait to show me that she had figured out how to tie her own shoes and how she was going to a wrestling Clinic starting this week (that is a whole other story)..
You look around (and you don't have to look very far) and see some of the challenges alot of people have to face it doesn't take long to figure out how blessed we really are....

[joshimoto son]

To touch on both Tom and Moto's comments.

For me, it's too easy to strive for more, even when everything else around me couldn't be better, I still focus on the things that are lacking. WHY?

I struggle with the fact that I know what I'm good at and what would be easy to do. It just does not follow with my goals.

Does that mean I should change my goals and drop what I'm doing?
Is it okay to try and have it all?

I also understand the meaning of "praying precisely". Learned it the hard way on the Mississippi River once.

Tom has touched on something that has been the focus of my life recently. I'm curious to what others think about his thoughts.

joshimoto son

[Cheetam]

As far as why we pray, it demonstrates our faith in Him.

Check out 1 John 5:14-15 re: prayer (of course there are many, many more verses we can look to...this is just one).

The Lord wants to have a relationship with us.  What better way to do it than to communicate openly and honestly with him through prayer?  If you really listen, you can hear Him communicate back.  Some people call it the "little voice" or others chalk it up as "intuition"; others refer to it as the work of the Holy Spirit.

Anyways, we are all blessed; some just choose to acknowledge it and some don't.

[Revtro]

Yep, that's a great couple of verses.  He hears us, He listens, and He acts.  He may not always give us what we want, but will always give us what we need.  Most apply this only to material things, but there's so, so much more than that.  It helps me when praying to remember that He's a dad just like my parents were parents.  He always has my best interests at heart.

[cr]

OKAAAY .....Heres my thoughts , and remember you asked for them .I'll start by saying that I respect everyones right to think for their self , and I also try to agree to disagree rather than argue . But I have a hard time buying into the religous beliefs of most people today . I believe in a God only because the World is so beautiful and life is so complex its hard to think its a random effect . But to believe in the Bible ,a book that is a product of man , Jesus , or the story of Jesus as told in the Bible , or the thought of Heaven , I think not . Also I think theres a fine line between Churches and Cults . Church people force their children to attend , line them up to sing songs like Jesus Loves Me ,ETC, then threaten them with the concept of heck.

But my main problem with prayer is , God made this beautiful world and lets us live in it , gave us our loved ones or health and the intelligence to make choices , so what do we do ? We ask for more !!!

God can I please win this Tournament , or the lotto , or save my life ,ETC...ETC...

Also there are so many issues in the world today that the religous right is just flat wrong , like gay marraiges . I'm not gay but have a few friends who are and believe me its not a choice for them . How can it be legal to be gay but not be legal to be gay and married ??

When I pray its mostly the same prayer "God what a beautiful day ,Thank You, amen" . Sometimes I ask God to look after my wife , who is dealing with cancer , or my 18 year old step-daughter , to make good decissions , but rarely do I pray for God to give me more than he already has , the intelligence to make choices .  

Take a look at someone you think is successful and ask yourself did that person achieve everything through hard work and dedication , or through prayer ?

I dont mean to offend anyone and realize I not the smartest person on this site , but thats the way I see it .

Please dont hate me if you dont like my views ,...CR

[joshimoto son]

CR,

I read it... I understand.
No offense here, everyone has "their own way".

joshimoto son

[Cheetam]

I'm not offended, nor do I hate you CR.  You said what you feel and I respect you for that, whether I agree or disagree...

I believe if you pray for material things and sit back passively for them to happen, well, you will be disappointed more times than not.  Personally, I pray for strength, wisdom, patience, perserverance, motivation, vision, etc (the foundations, imo, of hard work and dedication).  Will I get them if I sit on the couch passively and watch Bill Dance re-runs?  I doubt it.  But, I believe I will be put in situations where my choices, whether right or wrong at the time, will help me to develop/learn/practice/display patience, perserverance, strength, vision, etc.   I believe this to be true both in a personal and professional sense.  Success is measured on many levels and I believe you get out of life what you put into it (the old reap what you sow example) and this applies to whether you are a success in your personal/professional relationships, business, or on the tournament trail.

[Revtro]

Very well said Jeff, I very much agree.  CR- Don't worry, no one here is gonna hate you just for having a differing viewpoint.  We'll only hate you if you take all our money at the next big tournament we all fish together. 

Seriously though, your thoughts are very common.  I hear similar views all the time.  I'd like to offer you one thing to consider though, just as food for thought.  A lot of what we hear from/about Christianity is from the loudest among us.  Unfortunately this doesn't always represent the views of most Christians, just the most obnoxious ones.  So many of the things you're thinking may be the result of some bad examples of Christian people.  I.E. the thought that maybe we'd "hate" you for having a certain view.  Yeah, I guess there are some obnoxious Christians out there who would take a stance of ignorance and hate regarding the things you said, but most of us believe in the importance of loving like Jesus loved. 

This next comment isn't directed at CR or anyone in particular, but it's too bad the "idiot Christians" out there have so unfavorably flavored the opinions of so many.  It really pains me and breaks my heart because most of the truth of Jesus gets lost in the rhetoric of many believers.  It's akin to a little knowledge often being a dangerous thing.  But I guess that's a subject for another time and place. I don't want to get negative here.

CR- Thanks for joining in on the discussion.  I really appreciate your openness!  Yes, the world is a beautiful creation.  No way could it be a product of chance. 

[McCarter]

i pray to god and thank him for my daughter and for other good things that i have or that happen to me. 

i will pray to god and ask him to help other people if they are in trouble or in need of help.

i dont pray for things for myself.  i would never pray and ask to win the lotto or to stop going bald or to be better looking like Hunlee.

I have been known to pray to the porcelin god on a few occasions.  in that case i will ask him to make it stop and i promise i will never do it again.  but thats a different god all together.

CR, I will say a prayer for your wife.  I didnt know she was battling cancer.  If you ever need anything, just let me know.

McCarter himself

[Revtro]

CR, I will say a prayer for your wife.  I didnt know she was battling cancer.  If you ever need anything, just let me know.

DITTO.

[cr]

Hey guys , two things, one,thanks for the prayers for the wife , she's had two different types of cancer one a soft-tissue sarcossis 7 years ago and now she dealing with skin cancer . Just small spots on her back and face , but every time she goes in for a checkup they find something else . Today she had a spot taken off her face , but found two more spots . Maybe I should have clarified that in my original post . Not life threatening right now but still scary . Two, sorry about the large white space , my daughters puppy tried to jump up on my lap and must have hit a button .  CR

[TCook]

Against my best judgement I would like to join in on this discussion as well, even though I told myself to stay away from the christian board. I am always searching for logical responses (not biblical) from religious individuals to many questions I have asked myself ever since christianity was forced upon me as a youngster and all the way through highschool.
  As I grew older I looked at the world with deeper insight and I started asking myself many questions about the validity of a God and religion. Science became my main focus and I spent alot of time reading and watching anything that had to do with it. It was obvious that science is proven and logicly makes sense. The way i see it we are at an early stage in the course of evolution and there is still much to discover, so at this point no human being knows where, why, or how we came to be or what happens when we die. I beleive religion and the idea of a God is simply a product of human nature. Its our answer to deal with the unknown and death and is why it has been around forever, because we really dont know. It almost seems like the majority of the world is stuck in the past, when all that time and energy could be used to advance as a specie which is what the scientific world has been doing for 100's of years. If they didnt this site and your boats would not exist.  Not to mention if it was not for science and its discoveries in the medical field many of us and your loved ones might not be around today.  
  Here are some of the questions I asked myself when thinking about religion.

Why are there 100's of religions in the world that are very different in there beliefs? Which one is right? If christianity is the right religion are the billions of people who beleive in something totally different doomed?

Are we just a product of our surroundings? If one of you grew up in Iran with an islamic family would you be a devote muslum?

Whats different from a dog and us, they have a heart, breath oxigen, eat, feel pain? is there a doggy heaven too? Or is every other specie on this planet here for our use and amusement? Are they different because animals were not blessed with souls or did humans just evolve to be much smarter?

Should I beleive everything in the bible when it was written 1000's of years ago by man who at the time thought the world was flat and we were the center of the universe?

Is it possible that another planet among the trillions of planets in the universe could be at the same distance from there sun, have water, oxigen and support life?

Is evolution real? Is the bigbang theory real? If so does this contradict the bibles story of creation?

Why does so many bad things happen to so many good people, is this gods plan? I hear so many christians praise god for there good fortunes when in reality the bad seems to outweigh the good.

These are just my personal beleifs and are not meant to offend anyone. I do think that choosing to be religious is a positive way of life and understand why many of you take that path. To me logicly it just doesnt add up, My 2 cents.

T

[motocross269]

TCOOK you should try to read the book "The Shack"...It is Fiction, but tries to answer many of the questions you ask....Be ready to be touched though..I consider myself a pretty tough guy and that book opened up some of my deepest emotions, but gave me something to think about not only in my relationship with god, but my relationship with my family...I read the book in about 3 hours..I couldn't put it down...Do I believe the story...I don't know, but I enjoyed it and learned some lessons..
In that book the author touches on Organized religion. He also asks the question why does god let bad things happen to good people, Does god give us our independence out of Love, Love is not domination or munipulation, If he controlled us and stopped only the bad things wouldn't that be domination. He is allowing us to grow and be who we want to be..Right or wrong. I could go on and on, but it is a good book and a great story no matter what your beliefs are....
Has anyone else read it??
www.theshackbook.com

[Cheetam]

You have valid questions Tim.  I know I, and many others, have had the same questions at some point.  To try and give straight answers to your questions, imo, would really have little to no affect on your beliefs.  Quoting verses would have little affect as well.  That comes off as "preachy" and forceful in many instances.  Instead, I think it is beneficial to search out, and sort through, the answers through research and discovery, if you really want answers to your questions.  The answers are there, you just need to look for them.  Sounds like a cop out, but it's true imo.

[Revtro]

You know... jcheetam's right, so I deleted my response below.

As much as I love a good debate, I have found answers to be much more convincing when discovered, rather than have someone beat me over the head with them.  Moto's suggestion is a good one I think.  I haven't read The Shack, but have a good friend of mine who has been recommending it to me for the exact same reasons.  I think I'll order a copy right away.  That might be a good place to start.  I'd even be happy to read it at the same time as you if you were to get it... and then discuss it.

Also, to try to answer such heavy questions in a forum like this would take pages and pages.  If you want, I'd be happy to have an off-line discussion to try to answer them if you wish.  PM me any time and I'd be happy to engage you in a discussion about the very good questions you raised.  But please, only do so if you're really interested in the answers and are willing to have an open mind about them. 

Thanks for participating.  Your questions are very valid and quite common.  And there are answers.

[TCook]

Personally I have found the answers to those questions which is why i beleive what I beleive today. I just wanted to know how a religious person would answer and make sense of it all without citing scriptures, which is all I have ever heard when questions like those are asked. Since I beleive the bible to be fiction any scripture referances is not a logical explination in my mind. But your right this is not the right place for a debate which these things usually turn into, I just didnt want CR to be the only one with that point of veiw and agree with him 100%.

[Revtro]

That's cool.  Any time you want a "religious person's" answers without the citation of scripture, I'd be happy to engage you in conversation over PM, but only at your request.  There are very good and scientific answers to your questions if you are truly open to them.  But if you're not open, I don't think you'd be convinced.  I and the good folks who participate here are at your disposal. 
Thanks for your comments!!! 

[EliteFF]

TCOOK: To me logicly it just does'nt add up, My 2 cents.

You my friend, sound a lot like a younger man I knew about twelve years ago. I know what you are saying and probably why. Sometimes what you are questioning is being answered and is so blatantly right in front of you, but you might fail to see it for a long time.

In those days I(the younger man) did everything I could think of to discourage/disprove the thought that there was a so called God. I questioned the same things as you. I spent more time using logic to disprove a creator rather than sense.

One of the biggest factors contributing to my change of heart/thoughts was realizing that logic is something that we (the humans) have created. Our basis for rationalizing thought processes was created for, and by us. 

We have scientifically proven things based on what we believe to be true.
ie:
Carbon Dating- a formula created by math, that we created. 
Computers- that are only as technical as we have created.
Meteorology-that we predict weather very poorly with.
Psychology-based on human interaction based on reoccurring human reactions.
Chemistry-a periodic table full of elements that we manage to mix with one another under our sink to accidently wreak havoc.

All of the things related to science are based on what we believe to be the most "logical" reasoning. Where did all of these things come from that we have modified and used to create this scientific "logic?"

All of us believe in something for some reason or another. What you choose to believe in, is left with each individual.

I believe that:
I have seen sunrises and sunsets that no one else felt the same way about.
I have done things that I could have not done on my own.
I have shared many moments with friends that were not created by me.
I have been spared from death many times.
I have been used to spare others from certain death.
I have created bad times in my life.
I believe in a God that has asked that I believe in no other Gods, Idols etc.
That I have not achieved what was created for me, but not by me.

[djkimmel]

Life is a journey.

Sometimes... some things just have to be found by each of us in our own time in our own way. I'm still traveling my road. Will be for a long time yet (I hope), constantly looking, thinking, wondering, questioning... trying to decide many things.

Some of us find things quickly. And some of take more time. We may not find the same thing. Or we may find the same thing and even think we haven't. Some people are really good at talking to other people about important things, but in the end so much of it seems best if you come upon it on your own (or at least think you have).

Part of the journey is hearing what other's have experienced, even if the message is delivered at a time we might not be ready for it, and that is why I bother to participate in things like this board. I need to hear things from many different people and many different points of view so I can make up my own mind about things. It doesn't help to only hear things the way I like them right now either. There has to be many points of view, I think.